Re: [microsound] tools-mediums-questions++ - was: Re: [microsound]Csound/DirectCSound/PD

[Michal Seta <mis@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 10/19/01 12:12 AM, Garry Kling @ kling007@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

> 
> I couldn't agree more about the openness. If these artists are so badass
> that they deserve our money and attention, they will surely be able to
> survive the onslaught of a bunch of bedroom DJ's trying to imitate them. By
> sharing the information (and hopefully code) from the outset, they provide a
> challenge to the community (and themselves) to build upon it.

well, this is what they're afraid of...  They must _know_ there's a better
way of doing things and they fear someone will use their approach to do
something better...  And there's no secret:  they all use the same
techniques:  FM, granular stuff, sampling, scratching, whathaveyou.

> 
> I would have to say that any good artist can rise above the
> platform/software issue. IE, the artist sounds like themselves, not
> necessarily the tool. Great instrumentalists can make beautiful sounds with
> shitty gear, and the same goes for electronic artists.

well, a guitar always sounds like a guitar...  and a prepared guitar sounds
like a prepared guitar...

> As flexible as most packages
> are, its more a matter of comfort, learning curve, than it is one of
> capability.

some skill is required, be it in electronic or acoustic music.  Not only
physical skill but intellectual.  In my opinion at least.

> But, you can always use something for one thing, something else
> for another...

or use something in a way that it's not intended to be used...  That's when
it gets interesting (ie. prepared piano/guitar).

> 
> I happen to know some people in the polish scene you mentioned. There are so
> many guys over there using M on Atari's with patched together setups just
> doing great shows. They don't have the some preoccupation with technology
> progression that people elsewhere do. Not to rehash the previous thread on
> US materialism, but I think this is an example ...

I once read an interview with a guitarist from UK (can't recall who) and he
was asked why is English hard rock (or punk, can't recall) so much "rougher"
than the American.  He said, in England you have to work hard to get your
first guitar, first gig etc.  In USA a kid decides he wants play the guitar
and the parents get him a Stratocaster.  It all comes out in the music you
make.  I am Polish and although I don't know the underground so well, some
mainstream and some progressive bands were really good.  Even now, after
having gone through some music education, with some experience in various
types of music I have I listen to some of the music I used to listen to when
I was a teenager in Poland and I'm thinking "man, that was good!"  The sound
is great, the ideas are great, the engineering is great you can't even tell
some of it was done on arcane equipment.  There used to be a guy cloning
Fender guitars and I think some of them were better than originals.  I
sometimes think that some of the blues guys in Poland  (in the old days)
were as good or better than some American blues stars.

> 
> I've personally gone through a lot of tools, and I still use a wide range of
> them. Some things are easier to do on some packages than others. I think
> artists who only use one are really limiting themselves.

Well, depends what you use.  You can't get very far using only Rebirth.  But
you can accomplish _a lot_ with things such as Csound, Kyma, pd/max/jmax,
supercollider etc etc.  You could work with those all your life and keep
coming up with new ideas.

I think the problem is that a lot of the "bedroom" musicians lack basic
knowledge/skill in DSP, synthesis and al. and they _have_ to rely on simpler
tools (Rebirth, reactor, koan etc).  Perhaps they are good for some things
(Buzz came in handy a couple of times) but they're mainly toys IMHO.  And
some of them are overpriced.

Open software opens a door but not everyone will go through it.  Most of
open software is not as user-friendly as commercial software (well, if you
assume that what you see in commercial software is called
user-friendliness...) and people are scared to learn.  I just recently
discovered ecasound and was freaking out that it's a multitrack recorder
without a GUI!.  It's a relief, though, from ProTools ugly interface or
totally ugly Logic or colorful Cubase.  How many people on this list are
thrilled by the idea of using a command-line tool for their multitrack
recording?  Probably not many.  There are no jumpy level meters, no cursor
showing you the position in the song.  Not that I will continue using it all
my life but it's fun being able to record without even having to boot to X.
There are some UI tools that interface with it but you don't have to use
them.  That's freedom.

ok, I got carried away...


../MiS