Re: [microsound] striated and smooth (was: music is the ultimate incorruptible)

[jeff gburek <tsazmaniac@xxxxxxxxx>]

my own stronger interest is not to observe what is the
same in cage as schoenberg as to trace out of
schoenberg up to what is happening now. in this
respect, xenakis out of messaien´s extension of serial
music and the further tendencies in computer music. it
was a discovery for me how christou stands right
between cage and xenakis, somehow, in this repsect.
the shadows of indeterminate music hang over the
development of improvisation as a compostional tool
(spontaneous composition, for example) and the legacy
of cage in the schools of reductionist improvisation
is troubling. witness malfatti: i´ve heard a few
people saying it is cage without metaphysics (not only
the zen but the metaphyics of 'pure sound'--whatever
that is--but which gives rise to another school (the
obsession with fielkd recordings or the object
manipulations of jeph jerman). what is interesting is
that all improvisors have attitudes in their work. but
they seem often nowhere near as forthcoming about the
ideas as are composers. maybe because composers had to
justify their relation to the open, to immanence, to a
system predicated on closure? whereas improvisors just
dont care to explain anything to anyone, fuck da
police, anarchism etc.? 

--- "mat.the.w" <craque@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> On 3/17/06 11:04 AM, "\js" <js0000@xxxxxxxxx>
> scribed:
> 
> > and although many have poo-poo-ed the equation of
> cage's music with
> > schoenberg, i think there is a similarity there.
> you just have to find
> > the right perspective to see it.
> 
> I would agree with this, though depending entirely
> on which Cage piece and
> not so much which Schoenberg piece.
> 
> > i think the comparison is very instructive. taking
> the music from
> > these two- seemingly so opposite, but actually
> very connected to each
> > other in many ways [not the least of which is that
> they lived in the
> > same mileu for a time].
> 
> Yeah, you were either in the Schoenberg camp, or you
> were in the Stravinsky
> camp. I think the musical relationship between the
> works of Cage and
> Schoenberg is mutable depending on what year of
> Cage's output you're
> comparing. Schoenberg's music is more obviously
> developed from his
> technique, whereas Cage completely switched
> techniques, and back again, over
> and over.
> 
> As D&G might put it, I would view Cage as smooth and
> Schoenberg as striated!
> 
> > where cage went further is that he embraced zen!
> they won't teach that
> > in music school, but his exposure to suzuki had a
> profound impact in
> > the way he made music and lived his life.
> 
> They do teach that in music school, cause that's
> where I learned it! :) In
> fact the guy who taught Cage where I was in school
> did his dissertation on
> that period of Cage's life, and did a study
> "decoding the catchphrases" that
> are associated. Suzuki of course is included, but
> there's a lot more there
> than just Cage getting into taoism and zen (even
> maoism at one point).
> 
> //\
> 
> 
> 
>
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j.ff gbk

http://www.futurevessel.com/orphansound/

http://www.mattin.org/desetxea.html

http://www.djalma.com

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