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Re: [microsound] the system that works for the great deal of people
i am assuming then that i must be one of "some folks".
i read pretty much all the posts. tried to follow. i thought the
analogies were weak. the mention of "free-markets" in those kinds of
contexts will typically raise a red flag for me. seemed like some
"other folks" were seeing the same flags. i also don't think it is
completely off base for those flags to go up. i did not ignore your
point, i just thought it was poorly supported and maybe just plain
wrong. i responded specifically to the characterization of MySpace as a
free-market.
personally, it took a while to get filled with the piss and vinegar;
and a good gin martini. i don't think free markets are the cause of all
evil in the world. i am not sure there are any free markets in the
world. and i think the idea of the free market has been used to
manipulate people into destructive behaviour. so when i hear that being
tossed around, i get a bad taste in my mouth. and then i have to wash
it down with gin.
peace,
dev
On Jul 15, 2006, at 9:12 PM, Jason Hollis wrote:
> Fiiiiirst off, the actual original context of me even mentioning free
> markets in the first place, had you or anyone else that had a
> conniption about it DEIGNED to read the actual post, was as AN ANALOGY
> for the way that memes operate. I also provided an alternate analogy,
> interchangeable, that of evolutionary process, in order to better make
> my point.. which was completely ignored as a result. But that's how
> the strawman crumbles, isn't it.
>
> But apparently when some folks see the words 'free market' immediately
> they're full of piss and vinegar, regardless of the context.
> "OMG dont you know that's the CAUSE OF ALL EVIL IN TEH WORLD!!?!?!!!!1"
>
> Lighten up.
> Get some shiatsu or something.
>
> So the strawman worked, no one even remembers the original context,
> and here we are.
>
> ~ !J!
> http://www.endif.org
> http://www.crunchpod.com
> http://www.thirdwavecollective.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "devslashnull" <dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: "microsound" <microsound@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 5:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [microsound] the system that works for the great deal of
> people
>
>
>> i suppose my absurdities are intended to merely point out the
>> absurdities of this theoretical discussion about the relative merits
>> of
>> capitalism and this supposed free-market that we all should be
>> allowing
>> to take its natural course.
>>
>> the way that free-markets and capitalism are playing out globally
>> cause
>> a lot of pain. innocent people are killed in conflicts in the name of
>> freedom, free markets, capitalism and greed.
>>
>> brutal stuff happens. and it is easy to sit and discuss mechanisms and
>> reforms. but when people get angry and frustrated they will get
>> violent. and then heads end up in baskets.
>>
>> not sure what you need me to "back up".
>>
>> i meant to offend you, and you took the bait. see how easy it is? and
>> calling me "little one" could be all that is needed to turn it
>> violent.
>> would you brawl over your ideas?
>>
>> maybe we should have a .microsound street fight over it?
>>
>> isn't that how we solve problems here in the ol usa?
>>
>> sorry folks for debasing the forum, this here free-market of ideas...
>> perhaps this serves as a .microcosm of the real world.
>>
>>
>> On Jul 15, 2006, at 12:17 PM, Jason Hollis wrote:
>>
>>> Precisely my point in responding in kind to devslashnull's
>>> absurdities. I have exercised restraint up to this point. Apologies
>>> to
>>> those offended.
>>> ~ !J!
>>> http://www.endif.org
>>> http://www.crunchpod.com http://www.thirdwavecollective.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Dear All,
>>>> I strongly protest the use of such obscenities. I suggest this list
>>>> to my students as one of the sources that have decent philosophic/
>>>> aesthetic discussions on music. The use of the word "fuck" and its
>>>> usual accompaniments are the least of my concerns ......but telling
>>>> people "their heads belong to a basket" or to "shut up".
>>>> If we will tolerate this "O'Reilly Factor" behaviors, why don't we
>>>> all shut up? Isn't that what they want?
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Tolga Tuzun
>>>> On Jul 15, 2006, at 4:25 PM, Jason Hollis wrote:
>>>>> Excuse me?
>>>>> What fucking planet do you live on?
>>>>>
>>>>> More the point, either back your shit up, little one, or shut the
>>>>> fuck up
>>>>> because all that you've done here is illustrate that you merely
>>>>> have a foul mouth.
>>>>>
>>>>> Show us supporting evidence or keep your bullshit to yourself.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fucktard.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ~ !J!
>>>>> http://www.endif.org
>>>>> http://www.crunchpod.com
>>>>> http://www.thirdwavecollective.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "devslashnull" <dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To: "microsound" <microsound@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2006 1:10 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [microsound] the system that works for the great deal
>>>>> of people
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> this is so fucking laughable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> safety nets, reform, regulation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> who is it that is thriving? take a look through the eyes of an
>>>>>> economic
>>>>>> phenomenologist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> bitch.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "thrivers" don't balance anything. and calling them mechanisms
>>>>>> belies a
>>>>>> life that has never been at the shit end of one of them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> fuck you. your head belongs in a basket.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (these last two characters are to insinuate that I politely
>>>>>> request
>>>>>> amnesty from the mechanisms that may punish me for my proletarian
>>>>>> dreams)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> oh the democratic discourse. i get such a chubby.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 14, 2006, at 7:23 AM, Jason Hollis wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How nice of you to provide us with such an UNBIASED reference.
>>>>>>> Marxist.com indeed. Good to see objectivity alive and well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The answer to these problems is not communism - which clearly
>>>>>>> failed
>>>>>>> in every case where it was attempted, just as pure unregulated
>>>>>>> hands
>>>>>>> off laissez faire capitalism failed similarly - but in properly
>>>>>>> regulating businesses, providing social safety nets, and
>>>>>>> reforming the
>>>>>>> loopholes in the democratic system that allow politicians to be
>>>>>>> bought
>>>>>>> by special interests. To the extent that this balancing of
>>>>>>> mechanisms
>>>>>>> is implemented in a national structure, that nation thrives.
>>>>>>> Until
>>>>>>> such time as that happens, yes, these injustices will continue,
>>>>>>> even
>>>>>>> worsen.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ~ !J!
>>>>>>> http://www.endif.org
>>>>>>> http://www.crunchpod.com
>>>>>>> http://www.thirdwavecollective.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Revolution #9"
>>>>>>> <hendrix@xxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>> To: "microsound lista" <microsound@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, July 14, 2006 3:23 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [microsound] the system that works for the great deal of
>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.marxist.com/usa-statistics-shock240506-2.htm
>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>> CommTom
>> Communications of Tomorrow
>> "it's only a day away"
>>
>> unique electronic music for the adventurous ear.
>>
>> http://www.commtom.com
>
>
>
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>
CommTom
Communications of Tomorrow
"it's only a day away"
unique electronic music for the adventurous ear.
http://www.commtom.com