no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in some form or
manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company are far more worse then
apple ever will be in that IBM supported and built technology for the
nazi's in world war 2. sp the technology that navigates thier ships or Im
sure the laptops they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before
they stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and think is
what Im sayign get it now????
you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being condescending but you
and the other person what ever his name is are and mor eover you say how
much you hate flame wars but both times I have posted recently it has been
you that manages to create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your
entitled to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !!
On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote:
I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response to
your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. Which i
also agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no offense intended.
Green peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits.
Where Green Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources
go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to live in
balance with his environment. Sure they need modern technology in order
to operate with any sort of effective impact. They do so with a lot of
foresight. Are they perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in this
world, but to claim that they are no different then mega corporations, or
entities driven solely by profits is misguided.
It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What predicates a
solid opinion is that it is well thought out as well as being based with a
solid point of reference, i.e. facts.
Again no offense intended.
aLEKs
On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote:
his responce was extreemly condisending...
towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then he
does...
On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote:
You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not see
how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite actually.
You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If everyone was to act
as you do this list would be one giant flame war. What are you even
being defensive about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your
response? His first response was a very logical and well thought out
observation.
Have some respect...
aLEKs
On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote:
oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper
class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit!
its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white
academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in tear
gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me!
On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote:
it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best
misguided.
Neil Wiernik <neil@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
its not a wierd rant at all...
its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others
trash...
On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote:
what a strange rant...
yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of
being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they
make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to
make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will
probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings
made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with
wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with
society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach.
will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can.
i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world
and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier
campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet
your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how
well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned.
this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it
calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in
general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public
image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish
that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on
the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method?
xe
Neil Wiernik wrote:
the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if
they do
they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to
spin
things that way any how...
why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them...
rather then against..
Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who
IBM
helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are
holier
then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what
powers
thier boats GAS who makes the GAS...
I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take
the
time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses
me
off!!!
On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote:
unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing
specific companies then making a POINT
e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco,
Esso etc. etc. etc.
and now Apple?...
It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why
not talk about
all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the
problem, and work for
enacting national legislation following the
progressive European
lead in this area? Targeting a single company
seems gratuitous...
Send instant messages to your online friends
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
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